The Truth About The Pre- Tribulation Rapture, John Nelson Darby And Margret MacDonald
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Will there be a Pre-Tribulation Rapture? Was the Rapture made up by John Nelson Darby and taken from a prophetic vision by a 15 year old girl? Why is the Pre-Tribualtion Rapture attacked like no other idea. The great thing about the Pre-Tribulation Rapture is that it doesn’t make you rely on it as a doctrine of faith. It is a blessed hope given by God, that when the time of trouble come we will be snatched away like Noah was during the flood. Why is dispensationalism a controversial subject? Who was Margaret MacDonald and did she influence John Nelson Darby? Join Gary Stearman and Bob Ulrich as they explain this controversial topic.
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Whistler Blowers, Insiders
The truth about the pre-trib rapture is that it is a vile satanic lie.
“vile satanic lie”
Hahahaha !! So says the mouth of a SDA one who believes in Hell on white a WITCH (a prophetess on her Satanic trip to heaven with an Angel (SATAN Himself) who says
a Halo around the forth Commandment confirms her teachings…go figure. 
TRUTH….The 5 Wise virgins
WENT OUT TO MEET HIM ( Y’shua) 
HE CAME BY HIMSELF and TOOK the BRIDE from amongst the believers (10) (in tact, no heads missing) THEN THEY went with HIM THROUGH the DOOR 
as in the days of Noah … and escaped ALL THESE THINGS as per HIS PROMISE in Luke 21:36 to His people …Confirmed in this Parable of the 10 virgins matt 25.
So WHO is the WRETCHED VILE SATANIC LIAR ….the one who Denies …as it is written about Gods Precepts of Rescue He gave in the examples of Noah and Lot ,etc etc etc through out the Word on how He ALWAYS rescues His people as God knows how to rescue the righteous EVER TIME.
2 Peter 2:9
then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment,
Malachi 3:16-18 – 16
18 So you will again distinguish between the righteous and the wicked, between one who serves God and one who does not serve Him.
17 “They will be Mine,” says the LORD of hosts, “on the day that I prepare My own possession, and I will spare them as a man spares his own son who serves him.”
It’s not escapism for His people the STAND on the Precepts of Rescue given to us By God in His examples
He gave us 
Materialistic thinkers malign spiritual books out of ignorance. And there are many who know this; perpetuate the same by design to keep people in that mode.
The Baptist (predecessor to the Christ) repeated a message: Change you thinking. He did this knowing that unless people worked toward real spiritual concepts, they would miss the Christ impulse. Likewise, the Buddha was a predecessor, as well; taught of love and compassion, so that people might recognise the power of love and compassion (i.e. the Christ).
Unfortunately, materialistic thinking (Note: this does NOT mean only wanting material things- that’s a sub-effect) drags it all downward. Nay, you must work UPWARD to the spirit.
And all you people attempting to spread fear of people approaching the spirit- you are Satan (the opposer of Christ). God is honoured in truth and spirit. Spirit was removed from Christianity in 869AD in Constantinople. That coupled with a jesuit-inspired/modern education made sure to remove spirit from everything. That’s right- your materialistic education is bunk; impotent without spirit. Interestingly, most depend on the same to work through spiritual books/offerings. Truth is bitter. Change your thinking.
NOAH Was Not Snatched Away… It Stayed And Witnessed Abba Fathers Punishment For Those That Denied Him… As Today People Are Called To Witness… The Rest Are Judged As In NOAH’s Day… No Outcasts Allowed Here… As The Name NOAH Means…
The foundation of the rapture theory was laid over 400 years ago upon the specific orders of the Catholic Church. Every Christian needs to understand how this fabrication of error was designed to neutralize the great Protestant Reformation. If the facts of history were known by Protestants today who defend with such great emotion the rapture theory and the futurist antichrist doctrine, they would be horrified.Luther and his fellow reformers boldly identified the pope as the “man of sin,” and labeled the Catholic Church as the antichrist of prophecy. In response to those charges, the hierarchy assigned two Jesuit priests to develop counter- interpretations which would turn the onus away from the Catholic Church. In spite of the fact that the two men founded opposing schools of interpretation, their theories have survived to form the basis of most modern Protestant theology today. Not only did they effectively blunt Luther’s assessment of the papacy as the antichrist, but they cleverly divided and diluted the “protest” of all the churches which grew out of the Reformation movement. Modern religious observers were astounded in January, 1984, when men like Billy Graham and Jerry Falwell meekly accepted and defended the establishment of United States political ties with the Vatican. Why could those famous Protestant spokesmen see no danger in being allied with the Church of Rome? Because they are deceived, along with millions of others, by the Catholic-contrived theories of those two priests which have almost eclipsed the historic, biblical position of the Reformers. If the spiritual descendants of Luther and Wesley now had the same doctrine which they taught, not a single Lutheran or Methodist would favor any kind of alliance with the papacy today.
Now let’s take a look at these two Spanish priests who flooded the sixteenth century with their counter-Reformation propaganda.Alcazar of Seville applied all the beast prophecies to Antiochus Epiphanes, who lived long before the popes began to rule in Rome. His system of interpretation came to be known as the Preterist School of prophecy.On the other hand, Jesuit Francisco Rivera invented a system known as the Futurist School of interpretation. He taught that the antichrist was to be some future superman who would appear near the end of time and continue in power for three and a half years. It is his clever, unscriptural theory which has been resurrected by modern evangelical Protestant Christians. And today millions of Baptists, Methodists, Pentecostals, etc., hold this anti-Protestant concoction of the Jesuits as some kind of infallible doctrine. Yet, those same denominations claim to be faithful supporters of Protestant theology. Luther and other stalwart protestors against Catholic errors would be astounded if they were suddenly resurrected to hear what is being taught in the name of Protestantism. In the early 1800s the futurist view of Jesuit Ribera passed through certain refinements and additions, including the seven-year tribulation and the snatching away of the saints. For the first time, it was espoused by Protestant teachers who were seeking ways of reconciliation with Rome. Through the influence and writings of John Nelson Darby of the Plymouth Brethren Church in England, the new doctrine spread to the United States. During the middle and latter nineteenth century, it received its biggest boost from Cyrus Scofield, who incorporated it into the notes of his Scofield Reference Bible published in 1909. -Rendevous in space
http://www.remnantofgod.org/rapt2.htm
A COLLECTION OF VERSES LINKING TRIBULATION WITH CHRISTIANS
Hint: WE WILL BE HERE!
Psa.27.5 For in the time of trouble he shall hide me in his pavilion: in the secret of his tabernacle shall he hide me; he shall set me up upon a rock.
Psa.37.39 But the salvation of the righteous is of the LORD: he is their strength in the time of trouble.
Matt.10.17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues;
Matt.10.18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles.
Matt.10.19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak.
Matt.10.20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.
Matt.10.21 And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.
Matt.10.22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Matt 24:9-14 “Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name’s sake. And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.”
Matt.24.22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened.
Matt.24.23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
Matt.24.24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Matt.24.25 Behold, I have told you before.
Matt.24.26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
Matt.24.27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Luke 21:28 When these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh..
John.16.33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.
Acts.14.22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.
2 Thes 2:9 “Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,”
Rev.1.7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen
Rev.7.14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
John 17:15, “I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.”
Jesus Christ Himself, in a prayer FOR US is asking His Father that we are NOT taken out of the World, rather He wants us protected WHILE we’re here. Hence, this Biblical FACT…
Psalms 91:10, “There shall no evil befall thee, neither shall any plague come nigh thy dwelling.”
As for your list of verses… NONE PERTAIN TO THE BRIDE …they are for
Jacobs Trouble New Jewish believers (thanks to the ELECTed 144,000 witnesses) who are the delivered up to 
the synagogues to give an account of their new Faith in Y’shua and must endure till the End . 
Nobody just one day out of the blue made up the pretrib rapture, it has always been in the Holy Bible. Reprobates are misinterpreting the Holy Scripture. St. Paul tells us to comfort one another, because we are not to suffer God’s wrath of the wicked. Very shortly, Jesus Christ will come and gather HIS CHOSEN from the four corners of the earth. You better be ready because it is going to happen very soon, believe in Jesus Christ and you and your household will be saved! The non-believers and the wicked will burn when Jesus Christ burns them up in a great tempest! 2Esdras 13:3-13 3And I beheld, and, lo, that man waxed strong with the thousands of heaven: and when he turned his countenance to look, all the things trembled that were seen under him. 4And whensoever the voice went out of his mouth, all they burned that heard his voice, like as the earth faileth when it feeleth the fire. 5And after this I beheld, and, lo, there was gathered together a multitude of men, out of number, from the four winds of the heaven, to subdue the man that came out of the sea 6But I beheld, and, lo, he had graved himself a great mountain, and flew up upon it. 7But I would have seen the region or place whereout the hill was graven, and I could not. 8And after this I beheld, and, lo, all they which were gathered together to subdue him were sore afraid, and yet durst fight. 9And, lo, as he saw the violence of the multitude that came, he neither lifted up his hand, nor held sword, nor any instrument of war: 10But only I saw that he sent out of his mouth as it had been a blast of fire, and out of his lips a flaming breath, and out of his tongue he cast out sparks and tempests. 11And they were all mixed together; the blast of fire, the flaming breath, and the great tempest; and fell with violence upon the multitude which was prepared to fight, and burned them up every one, so that upon a sudden of an innumerable multitude nothing was to be perceived, but only dust and smell of smoke: when I saw this I was afraid. 12Afterward saw I the same man come down from the mountain, and call unto him another peaceable Multitude. 13And there came much people unto him, whereof some were glad, some were sorry, and some of them were bound, and other some brought of them that were offered:
peace
Get right with the Lord Jesus Christ and don’t try to fight Him even though He in flesh is an Oriental type Person. God Bless you
Rapture babies_reveals what ?
Let’s see, the same Person alleged to be the Rapturer live in true believers. So, why would a true believer be so ‘caught up’ with ‘rapture’ ?
Where 2 or more are gathered together in His name, He is also in the midst, so,
why so interested in a rapture ?
Evan in Psalms it is proclaimed that He dwells in the midst of the praises of His people, so why the big deal of a rapture ?
Go to “some” gatherings of true believers, and His Holy Presence is so strong, you might want to learn humility real fast.
Rapture ?
pierced–
I am in agreement on the satanic rapture lie, but I sense you and your group of “true” believers also speak in tongues.
Am I correct?
Truthseeker, the phrase “true believers” is only in context reference to those
who are born of God, John 1, and are abiding in Him and He in them, John 15.
Speaking Holy Spirit languages is one of the normal expressions
of believers, those who have believed into Him in this way, like me.
These signs shall follow those who believe_Mark 16.
And, He said that it is enough that the disciple becomes as their Master.
I believe that all believers can speak Holy Spirit languages, it is just that they get limited one way or another, through false doctrine.
So, there is believing into the Master’s holy character, and there is also
believing into His Divine Power which expresses His holy loving character. And one of those Mighty powers is speaking Holy Spirit languages for
all of the reasons that He chooses to use the speaking for, as He leads.
His ways and thoughts are higher than ours, than the heavens are above the earth. Isaiah 55:9
Pierced
One of the “gifts” of God the Father’s Spirit given to SOME is the gift of speaking in languages so the Good News can be preached around the world.
This gift of God the Father is not so ‘all’ can make satanic noise that no one understands including the person doing the mumbling.
Why would God the Father now after almost 6000 years want folks to speak sounds no one understands??
And pierced, I look forward to being “born again” at the return of Jesus Christ on the Feast of Trumpets – born into immortal “incorruptible” Spirit in the image of my Father and His Son. Now I am a spiritual fetus waiting for that Spiritual birth into my Father’s family.
By the way am123 is a big fan of speaking in satanic gibberish and HE hates the rapture
Exactly how does with work in the overall scheme of things??
You two speak gibberish and yet are far apart – is that a fruit of the speaking in tongues?
By the way my sister speaks in many tongues and she has her own church and follow demons and HATES Jesus Christ.
Me thinks me not do gibberish!!!!! very dangerous
pierced
sorry there are so many on BIN some times I get the player mixed
both you and am123 know the rapture is a lie.
but crazy times is waiting for the snatching I wonder if he talks gibberish as well?
From his comment here — it seems like gibberish
Truthseeker said:
“By the way am123 is a big fan of speaking in satanic gibberish”
Truthseeker is in opposition to the Apostle Paul. Paul said speaking in tongues is self-edifying and believers should eagerly desire this gift from the Holy Spirit.
seekertruth “By the way am123 is a big fan of speaking in satanic gibberish and HE hates the rapture’
Hahahah goes with the Pic and his stories
Halo.. there 321
how ya Bin..?
couldn’t help myself …please forgive me !!!
That being said, h humm !! god I am not 321 claims to be Born again as I do, so that’s 3 of us here atm who advise the same recipe even though we differ on, End Time events, these are generally not salvation issues that we differ on, we are in agreement on… “Ye Must be born again”
321… does NOT HATE the RAPTURE,
He’s a rapture believer just not a PTR one , but were working on it …lol
Crazy said:
“321… does NOT HATE the RAPTURE,
He’s a rapture believer just not a PTR one , but were working on it …lol”
Yes we’re working on moving your timing on the rapture ahead by about 42 months or so, because we don’t want you and other believers to be unprepared when the ravages of the beast come, for we are told to remain firm in our faith UNTIL the end, not until BEFORE the end.
seekertruth the parable of the 10 virgins to hard for you ?
where did the 5 Wise virgins go ?.
…no gibberish now !!! like your 1st 2nd heaven nor your wilderness opinion as they went with HIM… Y’shua …Where too ?
crazy
I am well aware of Matthew 25 — I am waiting now for the CRY that is to wake up the Church of GOD.
I would love you see you point out the words that state the 5 wise GO TO HEAVEN — they will go into the marriage and the 5 that are not wise are locked out of the Kingdom of God.
Yes half of God the Father’s called out ones will be kings and priest and rule with Christ here on earth for 1000 years.
I can find not one statement saying any have or will ever go to the third heaven..
In Rev 12 it states the women, the church, fled into the wilderness for 1260 days — is the 3rd heaven a wilderness??? really?
seekertruth
“they will go into the marriage ” Correcto mundo Tick !
So you have NO answer for me Where they went ?,even though its OBVIOUS …
‘I would love you see you point out the words that state the 5 wise GO TO HEAVEN”
The 5 wise where taken trough the Door
AS THEY ARE THE BRIDE “a door standing open in heaven” Rev 4:1 this is LONG before the Antichrist in 6:1
Behold, I have put before you an open door which no one can shut, because you have a little power, and have kept My word, and have not denied My name Revelation 3:8
“I can find not one statement saying any have or will ever go to the third heaven..”
This is the 5th time I’ve given you these various verses, 5th time really !!
TRUTH…John 14:2 In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I GO TO PREPARE A PLACE FOR YOU. 3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and RECEIVE YOU TO MY SELF; that where I am, there you may be also.
Where did He go to prepare a place for the Bride ? The FATHERS HOUSE…therefore Obviously Heaven
Hebrews 11:16
for HE has PREPARED a CITY FOR THEM.
Instead, they were longing for a better country–A HEAVENLY ONE. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God,
Rev 3:12
I will make him a pillar IN THE TEMPLE OF MY GOD, and he will NOT GO OUT FROM IT ANYMORE and I will write on him the name of My God, and the name of the city of My God, THE NEW JERUSALEM, which comes down out of heaven from My God,
THE TEMPLE OF GOD IS IN YOUR THIRD HEAVEN…. YES
That’s where He Takes the BRIDE Through the Door as per above INTO the Temple of God, as promised above,
Rev 21 v 9 CLEARLY Shows the Bride the Wife in the New Jerusalem as Promised COMING DOWN FROM HEAVEN.
“In Rev 12 it states the women, the church, fled into the wilderness for 1260 days”
YOU added the WORD
CHURCH this is not found in those passages the WOMAN IS KNOWN AS ISRAEL in Scripture 12 stars at her head.moon at her feet clothed in the Sun…is ISRAEL, look in the old Testament.
Israel flees into the Wilderness as its JACOBS TROUBLE…the AGE of GRACE has gone, the fulness of the Gentiles IS IN …we are about the 70th week the LAW JACOB TROUBLE those ones who keep the commandments of God the JEWS
Rev 14:12
12Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.
Adieu its 3am here
Seekertruth
” I am waiting now for the CRY that is to wake up the Church of GOD.”
I find this intriguing myself also “@at midnight also a Cry went out’ …Matt 25
What do YOU think that is “the Cry” ? an event an announcement a trumpet, last call ?
What say Ye seekertruth….as you Say…”I am waiting now for the CRY”
Hey Truthseeker, your response is a typical reason I usually avoid ever mentioning some of my abilities that I have being one with the Holy Spirit. You clearly are ignorant of the truth about Holy Spirit languages, and you use your sister as a prime example ? didn’t see too much other reference for your accusations. Regardless,
hope you keep seeking the truth,.
“This gift of God the Father is not so ‘all’ can make satanic noise that no one understands including the person doing the mumbling.”
Is it “logical” to say those things concerning that which you know 0 about ? except for the sister example, or probably some slanderous report somewhere from some ‘flesh minded’ believer or unbeliever.
“This gift of God the Father is not so ‘all’ can make satanic noise that no one understands including the person doing the mumbling.”
Of course God understands the language, angels understand it, and my spirit understands it, since after all, it is my spirit ( one with the Holy Spirit) that is the leader of my soul and body. And demons know what is being said, since I have seen them go ballistic when they have heard me speaking Holy Spirit languages. They don’t like God’s WORDS at all. God’s Words_be warned, it’s not worth speaking against that which you don’t understand yet.
You say that you’re not born again, but from what I have read of yours’ I disagree, and that I believe you are born again, and i have never heard of the concept you are speaking_ born when He returns on Trumpets?
So, if I am right, you have a lot on the table in front of you to enjoy, and you don’t have to wait.
pierced
The 7 Holy Feasts of GOD, not the Jews, are the events in God’s plan of salvation.
There can be no HOLY event that occurs on a day not already made HOLY before Creation — for HOLY USE.
The first is Passover which is not a Holy Day, but the day Christ took upon Himself our sins and paid the penalty for our sin for us.
The Feast of Unleavened Bread is 7 days, this is the over all plan lasting 7000 years, the first 6000 is for the first fruits and putting sin out of our lives and the 7th day is the Sabbath of Rest.
Pentecost is the day the Church of God was created Acts 2
The Feast of Trumpets is the Day Christ returns at the Last Trump and the time of the First Resurrection.
The feast of Tabernacles is the 1000 years reign of Christ and the 7th Feast is the Last Great Day which is the time for the 2nd resurrection.
I know you have never heard this before, but study it, this is why the early church kept all of God’s Feast including the Sabbath
I forgot the day of Atonement which comes between Trumpets and Tabernacles, this is the day Satan is locked away for 1000 years.
I will be keeping this day on Wednesday.
It been in the Word of God all along in Lev 23.
by the way Jesus Christ was born on the First day of the Feast of Tabernacles and was circumcised 8 days later on the Last Great Day. This is why we circumcise on the 8th day it points to this Feast.
No, i never related the Feasts to the 1000′s of years
scenario , I’ll check it out. And on the 8th day for circumcision, i had only known that it was because the 8th day was when the blood would properly clot, never related it to the Feast.
/alternative/2013/02/rapture-alert-millions-of-christians-have-been-deceived-2561260.html
Actuallly, John Nelson Darby got the Doctrine of the Secret Rapture from a Brazilian Monk named Lacunza who wrote the Coming of the Messiah in Glory and Majesty.
The Apostles got their belief in the Pretrib Rapture (as recorded in the Ephraem Document discovered by Grant Jeffrey) from the Inspired Book of II Esdras which used to be in your KJV for 200 years before they removed it.
Apocryphal books are not inspired.
21 reasons why the Apocrypha is not inspired:
The Roman Catholic Church did not officially canonize the Apocrypha until the Council of Trent (1546 AD). This was in part because the Apocrypha contained material which supported certain Catholic doctrines, such as purgatory, praying for the dead, and the treasury of merit.
Not one of them is in the Hebrew language, which was alone used by the inspired historians and poets of the Old Testament.
Not one of the writers lays any claim to inspiration.
These books were never acknowledged as sacred Scriptures by the Jewish Church, and therefore were never sanctioned by our Lord.
They were not allowed a place among the sacred books, during the first four centuries of the Christian Church.
They contain fabulous statements, and statements which contradict not only the canonical Scriptures, but themselves; as when, in the two Books of Maccabees, Antiochus Epiphanes is made to die three different deaths in as many different places.
The Apocrypha inculcates doctrines at variance with the Bible, such as prayers for the dead and sinless perfection.
http://www.bible.ca/catholic-apocrypha.htm
Pseudo-Ephraem does not teach the Rapture!
(Pseudo-Ephrem teaches that Christians would escape the tribulation through death not rapture.)
http://www.bible.ca/rapture-pseudo-ephraem-latin-syraic-texts.htm
I think this is the perfect time to take a rank shit on the pre-Trib rapture with one verse from Scripture itself:
“I pray that you do NOT take them OUT OF THIS WORLD, but that You protect them from the evil one.” (John 17:15)
I think this is a valid cancellation to the false doctrine that IS, a pre-Trib rapture, since the Messiah Himself requested that protection be provided instead of some unfair escape for 7 years. This is never mentioned in scripture either. 1 Thessalonians 4:17 only says folks will be raised to meet Him AS HE DESCENDS. Revelation 21 says the new Jerusalem and earth will COME DOWN FROM THE HEAVENS. READ. LMAO
John 17-15 is in force and valid ONLY
Until Judgement day, which starts at the house of God first, the Church seen judged first in REVELATION THEN in Rev 3:10-11 the BRIDE is taken from that hr the final hr to where, to the Temple of my God.
1 Thessalonians 4:17 DOES NOT SAY HE DESCENDS to EARTH …You Rank interpretation STINKS as you added to that verse.
Revelation 21 v 9 Actually Say’s .. “Come here, I will show you
the bride, 
the wife of the Lamb.” (marriage wedding complete)
the holy city, Jerusalem,
coming down out of heaven from God,…
Question
How did the Wife of the Lamb 
get to heaven to be coming down from Heaven…?
Read ….also LMAO
I think this is the perfect time to say you have FAILED miserably in taking a dump on the PTR position with your ONE Scripture
really
In John 17:15, Jesus was speaking to believers today, it is relevant for believers today.
Case closed:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvHtrm-dZks
Hey 321 I wrote…John 17-15
is in force and valid. 
no probs
Maybe you missed that part looking through your long hair
“Yes we’re working on moving your timing on the rapture ahead by about 42 months or so once more”
If it was biblical, god i am not 321, THEN no-worries
BUT it’s NOT !! I’ve noticed in that comment you have moved BACK 42 months from your usual position as you always posted a Post tribb rapture before ! ? …Now we have just another 1260 days more to go, and then you’ll be a berean … :wink
And you may then also see ? the 69 weeks of Daniel WERE about
Israel, So obviously the 70th week WILL be about 
Israel HENCE THE NAME 
A BIG CLUE… 
JACOBS TROUBLE 
, a week is a Full 7 years…Yes !!….as the Fullness of the gentiles IS IN by then due, to the missing Church name after the 3rd chapter of Rev.
The sound of the ” DOOR SLAMMING” is very appro post really
seeing the Bride goes through it.. when 
HE comes for Her Himself 
…case closed indeed.
“I’ve noticed in that comment you have moved BACK 42 months from your usual position as you always posted a Post tribb rapture before ! ”
I have always declared the rapture at the end of the tribulation. I know my position better than you
For a Scriptural review, please see:
/alternative/2013/02/rapture-alert-millions-of-christians-have-been-deceived-2561260.html
“Will there be a Pre-Tribulation Rapture?”
Seeing as ‘rapture’ is an emotional state… Not unless you are a pervert and find tribulation rapturous. You never know, there are plenty of people who get their kicks via Sadistic masochism.
Hey Crazy,
Your problem and the problem with all pre-tribbers
is you conflate the wrath of the beast with the wrath of God. 
They are two different things.
We believers will be spared from the wrath of God—this we agree on.
What you are missing, what you cannot see
right now, is we will NOT be spared from the ravages of the beast.
god I am not 321
“we will NOT be spared from the ravages of the beast.”…No YOU won’t as you have taken away from …”as it is written”….so you are correct
But the BRIDE WILL…” as it is written ” given to you over and over ,Your just unable to receive it !! ,so that leaves me, Only to say YOU are correct, YOU will comes as you are called, a Tribulation Saint you shall be ?….as “what we seal on Earth is sealed in Heaven”.
As seen going with Y’shua In through the Door into Heaven intact NO HEADS MISSING at HIS APPEARING.
As promised by Y’shua Himself when He said, in Rev 3:10-11
I WILL KEEP YOU FROM THE HOUR OF TESTING….THAT HOUR….
v10″I also will keep you from the hour of testing, that hour which is about to come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth”
v11 “I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he will not go out from it anymore”
TO THE TEMPLE OF MY GOD (3rd HEAVEN) and won’t go out ANYMORE….Rev 21 v 9 COME I WILL SHOW YOU THE BRIDE ….THE WIFE of the LAMB…SEEN COMING DOWN FROM HEAVEN after a 1000 yrs….
NOW back to the reign of the BEAST.
“I WILL KEEP YOU FROM THE HOUR OF TESTING.
“THAT HOUR”..TO TEST THOSE WHO LIVE ON EARTH….(as opposed to those now in Heaven after this judgement of the Churches as it starts in the house of God FIRST)
WHAT HOUR IS HE TALKING ABOUT ?…
“THAT HOUR”…the Wrath part.
Revelation 17:12
WITH THE BEAST FOR 
ONE HOUR. 13″These have one purpose, and they give their power and AUTHORITY TO THE BEAST.
“The beast which was and is not, is himself also an eighth and is one of the seven, and he goes to destruction. 12″The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but they RECEIVE AUTHORITY AS KINGS
They receive AUTHORITY form whom
(GOD) and its for the BEAST for ONE HOUR …. 
.”THAT HOUR”…. the ravages of the Beast as you call it.
As you say, this is.. “What you are missing, what you cannot see right now
”
Make sure you don’t lose your head over this…
“We believers will be spared from the wrath of God—this we agree on.
”
Correcto mundo…… AGREED.
ALL the WRATH as it’s (GOD) who gave the AUTORITY TO THE BEAST and his Kingdom for
…”THAT HOUR”…which He says He will take the BRIDE FROM. 
Whoops!! Don’t know how that happened ?
to clarify with a verse and a Parable.
As seen here in this parable going with Y’shua, In through the Door into Heaven intact NO HEADS MISSING at HIS APPEARING….they ESCAPED.
when
they went forth to meet the Bridegroom Behold, THE Bridegroom cometh; 
go ye out to meet him, 
the Bridegroom came; and they that were ready 
went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut….No Angels come for the BRIDE at His appearing….. Matt 25
god I am not 321
“we will NOT be spared from the ravages of the beast.”…No YOU won’t as you have taken away from …”as it is written”….so you are correct
As seen going with Y’shua In through the Door into Heaven intact NO HEADS MISSING at HIS APPEARING.
As promised by Y’shua Himself when He said, in Rev 3:10-11
I WILL KEEP YOU FROM THE HOUR OF TESTING….THAT HOUR….
v10″I also will keep you from the hour of testing, that hour which is about to come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth”
v11 “I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he will not go out from it anymore”
TO THE TEMPLE OF MY GOD (3rd HEAVEN) and won’t go out ANYMORE….Rev 21 v 9 COME I WILL SHOW YOU THE BRIDE ….THE WIFE of the LAMB…SEEN COMING DOWN FROM HEAVEN after a 1000 yrs….
NOW back to the reign of the BEAST.
“I WILL KEEP YOU FROM THE HOUR OF TESTING.
“THAT HOUR”..TO TEST THOSE WHO LIVE ON EARTH….(as opposed to those now in Heaven after this judgement of the Churches as it starts in the house of God FIRST)
WHAT HOUR IS HE TALKING ABOUT ?…
“THAT HOUR”…the Wrath part.
Revelation 17:12
WITH THE BEAST FOR 
ONE HOUR. 13″These have one purpose, and they give their power and AUTHORITY TO THE BEAST.
“The beast which was and is not, is himself also an eighth and is one of the seven, and he goes to destruction. 12″The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but they RECEIVE AUTHORITY AS KINGS
They receive AUTHORITY form whom
(GOD) and its for the BEAST for ONE HOUR …. 
.”THAT HOUR”…. the ravages of the Beast as you call it.
As you say, this is.. “What you are missing, what you cannot see right now
”
Make sure you don’t lose your head over this…
“We believers will be spared from the wrath of God—this we agree on.
”
Correcto mundo…… AGREED.
ALL the WRATH as it’s (GOD) who gave the AUTORITY TO THE BEAST and his Kingdom for
…”THAT HOUR”…which He says He will take the BRIDE FROM. 
Calm down Crazy and prepare yourself. The beast is coming and the Church isn’t going anywhere yet. Like Jesus said, only those who remain firm in their faith UNTIL the end will be saved, not those who only remain firm until BEFORE the end.
god i am not 321….”UNTIL the end”
So YOU say 321.
but your NOT GOD to decide, 
The WORD decides and He clearly has show us in His Word, we are NOT under ANY Wrath and will be removed from “THAT HOUR” of the reign of the Beast which He (God) gave them Authority for..”as it is written” in the verses i gave.
The 5 wise virgins went to heaven and escaped ALL things…n Luke 21:36…(heads intact) as promised
the BRIDE i
Simply put your position is untenable
as We have agreed on, No “WRATH of God” on the BRIDE above 
“YES”
you wrote:“We believers will be spared from the wrath of God—this we agree on”
BUT THEN YOU say “we are here UNTIL the END” (of the Great Tribulation)…..
If the BRIDE as YOU SAY goes UNTIL the End you have gone through
ALL the Wrath 
You may well have the gift of tongues, BUT NOT the gift of discernment, same issues as destinedtobeleftbehind, no discernment for who is who in the Zoo.
You said, crazily:
“god i am not 321….”UNTIL the end”
So YOU say 321.
but your NOT GOD to decide”
——————————————————————
No I’m not, but the one who said this is (EMPHASIS MINE):
“But he that shall endure UNTO THE END, the same shall be saved.”
—MATT 24:13
Game, set, and match.
Good night.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0GZhCnN87I
He said it YES ! but you can’t have it both ways
…your out of context understanding of this verse is not consistent with your own post to me which IS 100% correct that 
believers will NOT experience the “Wrath of God”.
But then you post
“But he that shall endure UNTO THE END, the same shall be saved.”
Again I repeat your understanding is, this puts the Bride ALL the way through to the End of “Jacobs trouble” in your estimates …therefore All the way through the Wrath of God.
Again you can’t have it both ways
Game, set, and match. Indeed….
[Agreed, Amminadab. Here's a thing I just saw on the net that should be of interest.]
MARGARET MACDONALD’S MAIN POINT
By Dave MacPherson
John Darby, Paul Wilkinson, and Thomas Ice are among those who have flunked the Margaret Macdonald test by covering up and misinterpreting what she (as the pretrib rapture originator) actually stated in 1830!
My book “The Rapture Plot” discusses Margaret’s two-part main point (lines 58-63 in her 117-line account): seeing “one taken and the other left” before “THE WICKED” (Antichrist) is “revealed.”
Hal Lindsey’s “The Rapture” correctly says she taught “a partial Rapture” – that only PART of the church will be pretribbed up.
Walvoord’s “The Rapture Question” also describes partial rapturists as “pretribulationists,” and their charts show the “church” BEFORE AND AFTER their rapture in the same way Margaret was a “church splitter.” (Google “X-Raying Margaret,” “Margaret Macdonald’s Rapture Chart,” and “Pretrib Rapture’s Missing Lines.”)
Both John Cardale (in Edward Irving’s journal in Dec. 1830) and John Darby (in his 1853 book) described their visits to mid-1830 meetings Margaret conducted in her home. Darby’s “recollection” was such a mirror of the many details in Cardale’s published account 23 years earlier that I’m convinced that Darby was merely copying Cardale’s details, and Darby listed all of the details except one!
Although Darby mentioned Margaret’s “texts on overcoming” (the “tribulation” or second half of her main point), he deliberately omitted her emphasis on “the coming of the Lord” (rapture) as the church’s “deliverance” before the “judgments coming on the earth” which all visitors, except Darby, admitted was a pretrib event (the “rapture” or first half of her main point)!
Margaret’s visitors included writers for Irving’s journal “The Morning Watch.” Within weeks it reflected Margaret’s unique and original “church/church dichotomy” (“spiritual” church members raptured and “less spiritual” church members left behind) when it saw the “Philadelphia” church raptured BEFORE “the great tribulation” and the “Laodicea” church left on earth.
Well, if Darby could be a revisionist with Margaret’s words, so could Wilkerson and Ice today.
After Joe Schimmel’s Good Fight Ministries produced the “Left Behind or Led Astray?” video (the greatest video exposure ever of pretribism’s dishonesty-riddled history!), Britisher Paul Wilkinson savagely attacked it in an uber-unscholarly way in a video produced by the Berean Call Ministry titled “Left Behind or Led Astray? – Exposed.”
In order to please his think-alike idol, John Darby, Wilkinson deliberately stopped his quotation of Margaret at line 45 so that he could omit the first (pretrib) part of her main point in order to be able to falsely declare that she advocated “a post-tribulation Rapture”!
Thomas Ice has been even more nervy than Wilkinson, his British “twin.” When Ice quoted Margaret’s 117-line account in the Dallas Seminary journal he omitted ALL OF HER MAIN POINT but made up for it by quoting just BEFORE and AFTER it! (Ice’s “PhD” was “earned” at the unaccredited Tyndale Seminary in Texas which, according to World Net Daily, was heavily fined by the State of Texas for illegally issuing degrees – too many degrees for the Texas heat!
Finally, if Ice, Wilkinson and other pretrib escape artists love Jews and Israel as much as they say they do, why don’t they want to be on earth during “Jacob’s trouble” to aid and comfort Jews and others? (Some Google items related to this include “Greatest Hebrew-Christian Scholars NOT Pretrib,” “Roots of Warlike Christian Zionism,” and “Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty.”