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By Arthur Trafford
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Did Jesus Sin When He Turned Water into Wine at Mary’s Request?

Wednesday, October 26, 2016 9:38
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The first miracle that Jesus did was turning water into wine John 2:1-11.  When the mother of Jesus requested that He turn water into wine, Jesus refused and stated, “My time has not yet come”. Did Jesus abandon the will of His Heavenly Father?  In performing this miracle did Jesus commit the sin of disobedience to God and refuse to honor His Father’s command and put His mother’s request as being more important or equal to Gods will?  Did Mary pull the “Do it because I told you so”; or did she spiritualize the request with an “Always honor your father and mother” if you love God.

There is a way for Jesus to please His mother and God at the same time. Say Jesus received this request at 6:30 P.M. (1 hour before sunset) then Jesus won’t know he can honor his mother’s wishes until 7:30 P.M.  The Jews consider sundown of any day to be the start of the next day.  After sunset God tells the body of Jesus that His time has come to start His ministry and share His Gospel (the good news) to mankind; then this request can now be granted Mary.  All human bodies are controlled by our human created spirits but the body of Jesus is controlled by the Spirit of God that isn’t human or created (that is why and how Jesus is different from the rest of humanity (sinless).

We are told that “Only” God the Father knows when His Son will start His Ministry and “Only” God the Father knows when His Sons ministry will be completed.  In the book of John we do not see a time line revealed and I find it easier to believe it was “Good timing” (or luck) on Mary’s part, for the joy of her request being fulfilled that soon after Jesus says “No” to her request shows that Jesus’ being faithful to God allowed Jesus to also grant the request of His mother.

If you think Jesus’ time still hasn’t come then Mary has just persuaded Jesus to obey her and do the miracle anyway; then Jesus has just performed His first miracle and committed His first SIN.  Even the mother he loves cannot persuade or entice Jesus to sin (even if she is unaware that this is a temptation to Jesus).

Technically speaking, who is turning water into wine, Jesus or God?  The truth is that God is the person doing the miracle of turning water into wine.  It is important for Christian’s to acknowledge the 100% humanness of Jesus and at the same time to acknowledge the Deity of God that indwells this descendent (Jesus) of Joseph and Mary who is also a descendant of Adam and Eve’s family tree.

In the Garden of Gethsemane Jesus is praying to God, and on the cross Jesus is praying to God; is Jesus praying to Himself?  The answer is no to both questions.  Human bodies (including the body of Jesus) have one thing in common with all other bodies; no one’s body has the capacity to think understand or perceive life, for our brains are responsible to give instruction to our bodies.  Even the brain of Jesus is 100% human, just like his heart, stomach, bladder, prostrate and colon etc. which are all created building blocks from Adam and Eve’s family tree (and not Mary and God).

God wasn’t human until He decided to put His Spirit into a human and be “Like us”.  The Spiritual thoughts of God are communicated through the cognitive skills that reside in the “Human” brain that Jesus received from the descendants of Adam and Eve; which is also why Jesus didn’t know when his ministry would begin or end, simply because his human actions weren’t prompted by human desires or the “Will of the flesh” but the Spirit of God direct the life of Jesus to be controlled by God “Only” and not human intuition or human (of Adam) fleshly desires. 

What God thinks is conveyed to the physical “Flesh and blood” brain of Jesus, so that the humanness of Jesus is aware of what God wants to accomplish in the life of this human “Tabernacle” called Jesus.  In the same way my human created spirit tells my brain to inform my body what it should think, do or say in any given situation.

Angels are spirit beings without a body, and about 2,000 years ago, God chose to join the human race and put His Spirit into the mind of a human.  Jesus is Deity because of God’s Spirit indwelling a human body; and Jesus is human because Joseph and Mary gave him a body handed down from Adam and Eve’s family tree (any other viewpoint is pagan thoughts added to the Christian Bible by sinful humans). 

If proselyte converts from the Jewish faith were the only people becoming Christians these last 2,000 years, then there would be no mention of a “Virgin” birth in the Christian New Testament; simply because the Jews “Know” that their Messiah has parents that are blood relatives (descendants) of King David and Bathsheba’s sexual union (no virgin birth needed in order to keep Jesus perfect).

The Jewish and Christian Messiah is the same person; but Jesus being the son of Joseph and Mary is just as miraculous a miracle as a virgin birth because God is doing the miracle and His miracles don’t have any degree of difficulty.  Let the Jewish Messiah be born like the rest of us; that way He is 100% human. 

God didn’t choose Joseph and Mary to be the parents of Jesus because they were more righteous than all other men and women on the earth. God let them be the parents of Jesus because they have the same kind of faith that Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and King David and their wives had. Nor were Mary and Joseph more righteous or pure than any of them. King David was an adulterer and Mary was sexually pure; so all that says is that King David and Mary struggled with different sins (for all have sinned and come short of the Glory of God—no exceptions).  

We all want to please others, especially loved ones and friends but we can’t be righteous if we compromise our faith, ignore the truth about our sins and assume and believe that God will overlook them and bless us anyway!!!


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Total 33 comments
  • Boo

    To your question, did Jesus sin, I’m sure not.

    • Arthur Trafford

      It is obvious that Jesus didn’t sin when he turned water into wine, simply because the God of the universe told Jesus that his ministry has begun (at that moment).

      Therefore, Jesus is now free to please and accomplish his mother’s request of making wine for her guest at their home.

  • Damien

    1. Jesus being the virgin son of Mary in no way stops him being 100% human. Mary was 100% human and all Jesus’ humanity came from Mary. Again you are either saying Jesus was not human unless he was the son of Joseph and his now ‘unwhorish’ wife (which you can never know and can only argue by denying the accounts of the post temple religion of Judaism that his mother was a whore).

    2. You also haven’t explained your reason WHY all of Jesus’ female ancestors in the bible were not also ‘whores’ by your deranged standards and WHAT your sanctimonious position is on whether they should be allowed to stay in your new Sola Pig Ignorance Bible or not.


    Among the forty ancestors of Jesus Christ listed in the Gospel of Matthew (1-17), in addition to Mary, four women are mentioned.

    They are Tamar, Rahab, Ruth, and Bathsheba, each with a questionable reputation.

    Having lost two husbands, both sons of Judah, Tamar poses as a prostitute in order to be impregnated by her father-in-law and thus perpetuate his line;

    Rahab, a prostitute of Jericho, hides Joshua’s spies;

    Ruth, a widow, manipulates herself into marriage with Boaz, a kinsman of Naomi.

    Finally, there is (whore) Bathsheba, the “wife of Uriah,” whom King David takes in adultery and eventually marries, and who ultimately bears Soloman, the future king.

    • Damien

      PERHAPS your Sola Pig Ignorance version of the BIble should ALSO exclude KING DAVID and the son he begat with and ADULTEROUS mother — KING SOLOMON.

      So that’s EVE (who couldn’t possibly have disobeyed God), KING DAVID, KING SOLOMON and the KING OF KINGS Himself.

      Who do the Seventh Day Adventists want to BAN from their Sola Pig Ignorance Bible next?


      • Damien

        WHATEVER shall we call this NEW religion of Sola Pig Ignorance that has BANNED


        KING DAVID





        Hows about …. ‘Judaism’?

  • Arthur Trafford

    Of course Jesus would be human if he was born of a virgin. God can make human DNA, but it wouldn’t be from Adam and Eve’s family tree on Joseph’s side of the family.

    But he wouldn’t be human “Like” we are. He would be a freak of nature that only reflects pagan religious beliefs and also fulfills the Greek Mythology dogma taught before Jesus was born.

    I think that Joseph and Mary would really appreciate the “Pleasure” associated with creating a child (without God taking Joseph’s place in the bedroom L.O.L.

    • Damien

      I wouldn’t experience any pleasure having sex with a 12 year old.

      • Arthur Trafford

        It is an asinine and ludicrous idea to think a child wants to be a mother at age 12.

        In other words, don’t steal Mary’s childhood from her. Let her in her late teens or early 20’s get married and have a normal child in a normal Jewish family, like all other normal Jewish families in the 1st Century.

        • Damien

          After Mary had completed her college education and rebellious / lesbo stage before working for some slimy New York politician based in 1st Century Galilee and then marrying her Hollywood sugar daddy Joseph?

          I wasn’t saying that THE TWELVE YEAR OLD Mary was at fault for Joseph the Saint humping her when she was twelve years old. You seem to just assume that she must have been the one wanting and asking for Joseph the sex hero having sex with her at that age.

          We KNOW that the average age of betrothal of females was at age 12 with marriage following at age 13 at this time.

          I think the tradition is that James, if he was the biological brother of Jesus, was certainly the older brother of Jesus so if Jesus was Mary’s first born Joseph must have had a child / children before Mary. So it has always been perfectly reasonable that he might not have had much sexual interest in the LITTLE GIRL he chose to become the guardian of before he passed on. There is no reason outside theology for Mary not marrying again and enjoying an intimate personal relationship with her second husband.

          • Arthur Trafford

            I have never been told that Joseph had been married twice. I have no problem with that concept because it isn’t really important (as long as he isn’t married to both of them at the same time) L.O.L. Most females can be attract to a man that is about 10 years older than them; but it is creepy and very undesirable for most teenagers and women to want to date and marry someone that is as old or older than their parents are. If I am 45 and have a 22-year-old son, then a young woman I would ask out would probably prefer to have a relationship with my son and not me.

            Incidentally, Joseph had to exit this earth prior to Jesus starting his ministry. Simply because, if Emmanuel (God with us) is inside the body of Jesus then it would be wrong for the Creator of the universe to be subservient to and have to obey the wishes of a human Joseph. As a father, Joseph would be given more honor, respect and authority over everyone else in Joseph’s family.

            Jesus had to obey Joseph and Mary while he is a child, teenager or adult. But Emmanuel trumps the hierarchy of human relationships. We are all born to die, even Joseph, but God would comfort Mary so that she could endure her loss just like wives and mothers do in this 21st Century.

          • Damien

            Are you some kind of rapist?


            ” it is creepy and very undesirable for most teenagers and women to want to date and marry someone that is as old or older than their parents are.”

          • Damien

            Jesus as God out, RAPIST JEWS AS GODS IN! :roll:

  • unidentified

    we know today that it is possible to implant a fertilized egg into womb and normal natural birth results, lots of people use ivf and surrogate moms to give birth to babies, there is lots of money made in the process today it isnt cheap, whatever modern practices we see today might not be as new as people think no one alive today knows anything about technology that existed two thousand years ago

    • Arthur Trafford

      It seems a little odd and silly to be talking about Mary going to a fertility clinic 2,000 years ago (even if they had modern day technology back then. If God is getting Mary pregnant, is He sterile or has an erectile dysfunction problem and has to go to a fertility clinic to get Mary pregnant L.O.L. Actually, God doesn’t have any sperm cells to give Mary (that would represent the essence of His being).

      God can create a sperm cell to get Mary pregnant by, but the 2 sets of DNA molecules of 23 chromosomes that are the building blocks that every human gets from their 2 “Human” parents IS NOT what represents anything to do with the “Nature” or personhood of God.

      Joseph had many children, so he is capable and willing to donate (in a romantic encounter) and give his sets of DNA molecule of 23 chromosomes to Mary his wife.

  • The Clucker

    So Mary wasn’t allowed to drink? What?

  • Arthur Trafford

    I am very surprised that the resident militant Christian Pharisees who make frequent stops on this website haven’t bothered to post any judgmental condescending comments to punish me for saying things that refute the “Traditions of men” that they cherish, promote and protect “Their” gospel truths that has been added to the Bible.

    This must be a very good essay when TCB, Mayhem, Maxwell etc. don’t bother to post any negative comments. And if they do agree with what I have said in this essay, it just proves that it is against their nature to say anything nice, positive or encouraging to me !!!

    • Mayhem

      An argument from silence is a logical fallacy, Arthur, and your attempt to conflate my silence with tacit consent should be beneath your sense of dignity.

      Shame on you.

  • Arthur Trafford

    Hello Damn EL

    Take your medication or change your medication because you are hallucinating about things that never happened 2,000 years ago. You might be observing things in your neighborhood that are strange, odd, or against the law.

    Or maybe the TV shows and movies you watch have distorted your perception of life and you project that information as being about Joseph and Mary. I won’t read any more of your replies !!!

    • Damien

      I think the clear anger you have towards Mary is just being exposed with every response to me that you make.

      I think I have figured it out.

      You do not care that she is a ‘whore’ because you care about ‘family values’. All Jesus’ female ancestors in the Bible were ‘whores’.

      Like Truthytits you think that you can only be a ‘Jew’ (the fact that that is a thing that didn’t exist in Jesus’ day being something you just keep ignoring) if you do not come through the male line.

      Probably because of some ‘serpent seed’ garbage going on in your crazed head.

      All purtied up as sanity rather than barking madness.

      Your explanations why ‘that little whore’ would never have unmanned Joseph.

      • Arthur Trafford

        Hello Damn EL:

        What religion do you claim to follow? It is unlikely that it is the Christian faith, because I have never heard a Christian use the same verbiage that you use.

        Christians can agree or disagree concerning the virgin birth, but they all believe that Jesus is the Messiah of God’s Salvation, who is Emmanuel (God with us).

        • Damien

          I’m still waiting for you to pontificate on Solomon being born of someone that Crazy Dave ‘King of the Cruisers’ just walked up to, b*tchslapped, dragged screaming from the street, threw in the trunk of his Oldsmobile and screeched off into history with.

          Your schoolmarm act is a sham.

          • Damien

            No one considers dual seedline retards to be Christians.

          • Arthur Trafford

            Hello Damn EL:

            I just became aware of what you are saying or implying in the name you have chosen to go by on this website. EL literally means “God” or “Deity”. So, you are shouting out the idea of “Damn God” or “God damn”. This means you are a very angry person who has probably been bullied by religionist most of your life. Plus having a witch riding a broom in your name title clearly reveals you are into witchcraft or Satanism. But I make no value judgments against you, for we are all sinners in the hand of a loving God.

            God has never done anything wrong to us. Satan, self and others are the main reasons why this life is so miserable and difficult to deal with. God redeemed all of us 2,000 years ago when God said “It is finished”. Everyone’s salvation was purchased at that time in history. If we believe that God exists and that He rewards us for seeking to love God, self and others; then we experience the abundant life. God has already obtained our spiritual salvation and we contribute to our physical salvation in this world when we obey God (don’t lie, steal, fornicate, commit adultery, kill etc.). In other words, we experience a little heaven on earth when we try to live by God’s standards instead of our own.

            If God created us and then prevented sin from ever happening in the first place, humans made in God’s image would hold the Theological view that God’s perfection and ours are equal in expression. In other words a perfect human that was never allowed to sin would say to God. God, I know you are perfect and you say we are perfect; so why isn’t our perfection equal to your perfection?

            There is no such thing as “Perfect, more perfect and most perfect”. You just have one word in English that doesn’t adequately define the magnitude of the true meaning of perfection concerning God. God is the source of our life and the reason of our future perfection.

            Since God allowed sin into the world, and in our future state of perfection, God would only have to show us a video of the sinful state of humanity over these thousands of years that humans have existed on earth; and we will totally understand even in our finite minds that God is the source of all love and perfection, and all humans are only the recipient’s of God’s love and perfection.

          • Damien


            Your schoolmarm act is a sham.

            DUAL SEEDLINE


      • Damien

        I meant of course that I’m guessing that you think that you can’t be a ‘Jew’

        if you do not come through the male line

        God not being good enough

        Jesus as God out, Jews as Gods in

        That Jesus coming only from Mary would not make him a ‘Jew’ (and that this is connected in your head with some crap about the 10 lost tribes of Israel).

  • The Watcher

    Tiberius Julius Abdes Pantera was the Father of jesus by raping an underage mary!

    • The Clucker



        The Babylonian Talmud.

      • Damien

        Pantera comes from the Talmud

        ‘Tiberius Julius Abdes’ Panthera comes from the supposed tombstone of a person of that name uncovered in Germany.

        Abdes being a semitic name. I think it might mean servant of God or something.

        Even if it is a forgery it tells something about the other historical ‘evidence’ of a historical Jesus.

          • Damien

            Interesting point:

            A ‘Pantera’ (panther) is a chimera.

            A being made up of many creatures


            Their faces looked like this: Each of the four had the face of a human being, and on the right side each had the face of a lion, and on the left the face of an ox; each also had the face of an eagle.


            A Panther is … an ANGEL

            That is a servant of God.

            An Abdes Pantera.

          • Damien

            A 2nd Adam Pantera (Kadmon)

            According to the Talmud

            I’m assuming it is a forgery

            But it is interesting that the Talmud considered Mary to have conceived Jesus with a ‘Panther’ (Kadmon).

          • Damien

            Abdes Pantera was at the head of archers.

            What happens on valentines day?

            Eros the God of Love shoots arrows from heaven like Apollo the far shooter and Zeus with his thunderbolts.

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