Visitors Now:
Total Visits:
Total Stories:
Profile image
By Arthur Trafford
Contributor profile | More stories
Story Views

Now:
Last Hour:
Last 24 Hours:
Total:

Who are those individuals these last 1,700 years who do not believe that Jesus came IN THE FLESH?

Tuesday, October 18, 2016 1:55
% of readers think this story is Fact. Add your two cents.

(Before It's News)

There is only one question that needs to be answered in this essay.  Who are the individuals who “Refuse to believe” that Jesus came IN THE FLESH?  “For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh.  This is a deceiver and an antichrist”. 2 John 1:7.

Every Jew, Muslim, Christian and even atheist who HAVE BEEN TOLD about Jesus, know Jesus has come in the flesh of Mary (born as Mary’s Child).  And no one would argue against someone saying that Jesus is the son of “Mary” and no one would refute the idea that  “Mary” is the mother of Jesus.

No one disbelieves or rejects Jesus being of the “Flesh of Mary” but “Almost” every Christian “Refuses” to believe that Jesus has come in the “Flesh of “Joseph” (Which is an “Against Christ’s statement).

Jews were looking for a military Messiah who could destroy the power that Rome had over them.  They were not looking for a suffering servant Messiah.  No Jew has ever believed in a virgin born Messiah, and they shouldn’t.  For the sake of argument, lets say that Joseph is the father of Jesus.  The Apostles didn’t have to argue with the Jews or the pagan gentiles; and if the pagans demanded that Joseph be the stepfather of Jesus the miracles of the Apostles would trump any opposition the Apostles would be confronted with. 

All Apostles could use their gifts of healing to confirm all gospel truths spoke by them.  If Joseph is the father of Jesus, then the Apostles could ask the person, “If I heal you and your family members, will you believe that Joseph is the father of Jesus and that everything we teach you about God is True”?   It is obvious that any doubters would quickly change their minds (and after their healings they would no longer believe a different message then these message from God Emmanuel).  Miracles by the Apostles were powerful tools to validate them as messengers sent from Emmanuel (God with us) housed in a human body of Joseph and Mary’s family tree.

All Jews and Christians are supposed to believe the verse “Here, O Israel” The Lord our God is one Lord”.  Christians believing in one God got them in trouble with the pagan religionist and the skilled craftsmen, who made the idol merchandise of sale.

When the pagans started hearing the Pope and priests in the 4th Century use the phrase “God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit” (misinterpreted as 3 gods) then the pagans knew that had seduced the Christians into embracing concepts of their pagan religions.  In order to please pagan religious leaders and the learned Greek Mythological philosopher’s Christians needed to add several concepts to Christian Theology (1) to promote the virgin birth that they already believe in (2) promote the preexistence of Jesus before he is conceived in Mary’s womb (which is how the pagans view their god’s (3) deify the body of Jesus (make it not part of Adam and Eve’s family tree) (4) not allow Jesus to marry (5) and not allow Jesus to have a child or children.

Christianity would have died in its infancy around the 4th Century A.D. for attendance would be very low in the church services since the Apostles miracles are not being done in the Universal Church) by the Pope or his priest.  When Jews and pagans talked to Jesus, their urgent or crucial issue question was  “Who’s your daddy”.  If Jesus or the Apostles say to the Jews that Joseph is the father of Jesus, then the Jews will rejoice and be very happy knowing that Jesus “Just might be” their Messiah.  If Jesus or the Apostles said God is his father of Jesus, then all of the pagans will want to become Christian, simply because the Christian faith is now much like what they already believe.  A stumbling block for the Jews is the virgin birth, and a stumbling block for the pagans is no virgin birth and no life existence of Jesus before conception.  Christians, Jews and pagans need to know that God is talking through a human being that is created by humans (making Jesus 100 % like us in our conception and birth).  Every persons conception is just as miraculous as a virgin birth, simply because God is doing all miracle and His miracles don’t have any degree of difficulty

After all the Apostles and everyone healed by Jesus are dead (including their children and grandchildren) and no one is alive that heard Jesus or the Apostles preaching a different Gospel Message, then the Church adopted Theology that would increase church membership by not preaching a message that the Jewish .2 % of 1 % population would agree with (no virgin birth or preconception living Jesus); but rather share a message that the other 99.8 % would appreciate, accept and promote these last 1,700 years.

The Universal Church in the 4th Century unknowingly protected Christianity from extinction when God allowed corrupt religious leaders to add, delete or change what is in the New Testament.  The Jews were in control of the Old Testament, so Christians didn’t have the opportunity to add scriptures that would validate any changes they made in the New Testament.

What helped Christians is when they picked 2 pagan holidays in which to celebrate Christmas and Easter.  Christians bullied their way into the pagan holiday festival celebrations of worship and the giving of gifts on these 2 pagan holidays.  Christianizing these holidays protected the Christian message that has coexisting up to and including this very day in the 21st Century in everyone’s communities.  For God knows at a future time He will separate the lies and truth that are representative in our symbolic wheat and tares analogy.  God will not harm us in this cleansing process for the tares will be cast into hell and the part of us that is in the Image of God will be “Made perfect” and we will spend eternity in the presence of God, His angels and each other.

There are no reasons for Jesus to exist before he is conceived in Mary’s womb.  Jesus is to be like us in every way, therefore his conception and birth should be what is normal for All” humans (unless you are trying to promote a gospel of paganism and Mythology).  Our God is only one person, who lives in the eternity past, present and future (and somehow all at the same time —in His “I AM state of being) so having Jesus to exist before he is conceived in Mary’s womb is unnecessary; simply because God is back there creating the angels and the universe and this would mean there are 2 God’s (since Christians claim the body of Jesus is God creating everything. 

Keep in mind that “No” human exists before they are conceived (not even Jesus).  If I have a wife, she and I aren’t parents until the wife confirms that she is pregnant.  All humans have existed for eternity, but only “In the mind of God ”.  God has commanded the human race and all other species to replenish the earth.  God doesn’t intervene when species become extinct (for nature in history creates and destroys life —and not God) and all reproduction of mankind is only done by the sexual union of male and female humans (or a fertility clinic, assist in that pregnancy endeavor — but no immaculate conception is needed.  It is abnormal, unnecessary and shows Christians think their God is just as inept, weak, unloving and has to incorporate ideas that predate Christianity and fulfill pagan and Greek Mythology concepts.

God isn’t a Messiah or suffering servant until God takes up His abode in the child of this pregnant teenager or adult Mary his mother.  And if Jesus did exist before his conception then he would be helpless to redeem us outside of our human existence (for he has to have a normal human body to complete his God given task).  Therefore God doesn’t need Jesus to help in creating our universe, since God the Father of all things is already back there before time began and if we have 2 Creators then one isn’t needed to finish the job.  Like the old saying, if two individuals are in agree on something, one of them isn’t really needed in that particular decision making process.

Our Father God is responsible for creating everything that is in heaven or in any created universes that exist.  Which is mostly outside of our awareness reach, or control.  Emmanuel (God with us) used a human body to touch our spirit, mind, will and emotions so that humans could observe what God would look and act like if God became “Like” us.

The Son of God is responsible for our salvation.  We are told that the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sin.  But for God to use the body of Jesus as a “Complete” sacrifice Jesus has to do more than just bleed. 

“The Apostle Paul A Williams on Facebook list the below 7 places Jesus shed His blood

1.       Jesus shed blood at the Garden of Gethsemane.

2.       He shed blood at the whipping post.

3.       He shed blood internally – from the intense beating.

4.       He shed blood when they put the crown of thorns on His head.

5.       He shed blood when they pierced His hands.

6.       He shed blood when they pierced His feet.

7.       Blood came forth when they pierced his side.”

JESUS HAS TO DIE in order for God’s love to be perfect and complete.  For a verse says “Greater love has no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends”.  God’s love has to be just as intense as our human love is (as in marriage or death) for our sacrifice is to other humans made in the Image of God of whom God loves even more than we are capable of giving. 

If my friend is walking outside at night and he has told me someone said they are going to kill him; if I am looking forward and I see a muzzle flash in the distance and I instantly jump in front of him and save his life so that he can run away and be safe.  But if I am hit in the shoulder, he will thank me for taking a bullet for him but I didn’t pay the ultimate sacrifice of love for him, unless I die in my friends place.  The fact that I jumped in front of him implies means that I was will to die in his place.

God because human like us, when God made his abode in a Temple “Like our” that is only fleshly in nature. Later, when God sets up His Kingdom in a new heaven and earth. God won’t dwell in a flesh and blood Temple, for flesh and blood will not enter the Kingdom of God.   We will see God as the angels view Him, face to face in all His Glory.

The bottom line:  Jesus came into this world to be like us in every way; in his conception, life experiences (but sinless) and in his death.  Therefore, acknowledge that Jesus came in the flesh of Joseph, or be an antichrist !!!

Sincerely,

ArthurTrafford.com

Report abuse

Comments

Your Comments
Question   Razz  Sad   Evil  Exclaim  Smile  Redface  Biggrin  Surprised  Eek   Confused   Cool  LOL   Mad   Twisted  Rolleyes   Wink  Idea  Arrow  Neutral  Cry   Mr. Green

Total 13 comments
  • TCB

    “Who are those individuals these last 1,700 years who do not believe that Jesus came IN THE FLESH?”

    You are. You are one who denies that He has come in the flesh.

    The very words “HAS COME in the flesh” (ἐν σαρκὶ ἐληλυθότα – in flesh having come) are a PERFECTLY clear demonstration of His preexistence. His preexistence is further demonstrated in Genesis, Deuteronomy, Psalms, Isaiah, John, Colossians, Hebrews and Revelation. But you say He had no preexistence and therefore you deny that He HAS COME (not ‘came’) in the flesh. That makes you an anti-Christ and a liar, according to the Word of God.

    You wrote:

    “For a verse says “Greater love has no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends”.”

    And, what? Do you believe this verse? Why? Why this verse and not all the others which brazenly contradict the false witness you spread? Why do you steadfastly refuse to explain how it is you THINK you can distinguish the faulty verses from the true? How is it you have arrived at your superior understanding of the Word of God, without the Word of God? Tell us, Arthur.

    How many times have you repeated now that Messiah was not born of a virgin – in naked rebellion to the many verses of Scripture which prove you a bringer of falsehood?

    How many times have you been asked to support your contentions with something other than your own repetitious assertions?

    Your message is untrue. Your doctrine is illegitimate. And Scripture calls you an anti-Christ.

    Yet you continue on as if none of it matters.

    Why won’t you think this thing through and ponder the consequences if you’re wrong and the Word of God is right?

  • All Jews and Christians are supposed to believe the verse “Here, O Israel” The Lord our God is one Lord”. Christians believing in one God got them in trouble with the pagan religionist and the skilled craftsmen, who made the idol merchandise of sale.

    ===============

    What the hell is it with you you Jesus as God out, Jews as Gods in RETARD?

    YOU KEEP BEING TOLD!

    10% of the Roman Empire WERE JEWS

    There was maybes a few score thousand Christians for a long time to begin with.

    • Meaning, of course, NOT that the (completely made up statistics) 0.2% of 1% of the Roman Empire who were children of Israel all rejected Christians but that eventually 99% of the 10% of the Roman Empire that were children of Israel embraced Christianity.

      ‘Judaism’ is a religion that developed centuries after Christ out of the few people who did not embrace Christianity.

      • Just like you have ‘come along’ 2000 years later with your own ‘old timey’ religion.

        WELL TOUGH!

        Christians: Before Abraham was I AM.

        Co-Eternal with the Father.

        Jesus IS YHWH

        YHWH is the son of El Elyon

        AND ALWAYS HAS BEEN

        NOT of Joseph

        • ‘Judaism’ is a religion that developed centuries after Christ out of the few people who did not embrace Christianity.

          =======

          Like Islam itself did a few centuries later to then be itself followed by yourself Arthur.

  • …Arthur Trafford has yet to be introduced to the Holy Spirit. his theosophy is entirely bound to this planet and its limitation. He can’t see what’s right in front of him.

  • I only asked “1” question, and TCB and everyone refused to identify who are the individuals that refuse to believe that Jesus came in the flesh? (The phrase ‘Coming in the flesh’ is not talking about preexistence but being born from the sexual union of Joseph and Mary).

    It is “Very very” odd that in all of these 1,923 words in this essay, that there is not even “One” positive comment of agreement on anything I have said, just others being judgmentalism and legalistic in there mindset. TCB and others strain a gnat and swallow the camel, and become very faithful, dedicated Christian Pharisees L.O.L.

    Keep being delusional in thinking the Pope and his scribe’s didn’t change the Bible message to please the pagans of his time, long before the Protestant Reformation L.O.L.

    Everything that is said by Jesus is referring to God only and not the body of Jesus. Jesus said, “Before Abraham was, I AM”. The “One and only” God has existed for eternity. All the “I AM’s statements are referring to God ONLY, and Jesus is telling us about Him. God became a son on earth to share with the human race about our Creator, and not himself.

    Sincerely,
    ArthurTrafford.com

    P.S. I don’t have time for all this nonsense. Share your opinion and I will share mind (but I don’t have the time or desire to argue with others) L.O.L. End of discussion.

    • The phrase ‘Coming in the flesh’ is not talking about preexistence but being born from the sexual union of Joseph and Mary).
      —————-

      Mustarthurtrafford.com

      There are no reasons for Jesus to exist before he is conceived in Mary’s womb. Jesus is to be like us in every way, therefore his conception and birth should be what is normal for All” humans …..Our God is only one person, who lives in the eternity past, present and future (and somehow all at the same time —in His “I AM state of being) so having Jesus to exist before he is conceived in Mary’s womb is unnecessary; simply because God is back there creating the angels and the universe and this would mean there are 2 God’s (since Christians claim the body of Jesus is God creating everything.

      ================

      The SON Jesus is YHWH. I AM THAT I AM.

      SON OF THE FATHER THE MOST HIGH EL ELYON

      • Mustarthurtrafford.com

        Our God is only one person, who lives in the eternity past, present and future (and somehow all at the same time —in His “I AM state of being) so having Jesus to exist before he is conceived in Mary’s womb is unnecessary; since Christians claim the body of Jesus is God creating everything.

        ================

        So say you don’t think Jesus is God. So WHY are you worshipping a human Jesus MustArthurTrafford.com?

        You think that Jesus is a prophet? Because he has the Holy Spirit in him? Like ALL Christians have the Holy Spirit in them?

        • Mustarthurtrafford.com

          HOW does the virgin Mary of Islam become pregnant without the agency of Allah?

          Is Jesus LITERALLY parented in by Allah unlike every other ‘prophet’?

    • TCB

      “End of discussion.”

      No, Arthur – the discussion with you is not at an end because it never began. You have refused to partake in a discussion and would rather waltz in here to pontificate. As I said before, your material can stand only as a monologue – it cannot stand as a dialogue because none of your ideas will withstand examination. I believe you know this to be true and that is why you refuse to engage any of us in meaningful discourse.

      “I only asked “1” question, and TCB and everyone refused to identify who are the individuals that refuse to believe that Jesus came in the flesh?”

      No, Arthur. What happened was you were given a very specific answer to your very specific question. You did not like the answer, so now you will pretend no answer was given. That is dishonesty coming from you. Why not try receiving the answer given to you and then interacting with it in conversation?

      “The phrase ‘Coming in the flesh’ is not talking about preexistence…”

      You’re right. The phrase ‘coming in the flesh’ does not convey anything inextricably linked with preexistence. But the phrase HAS COME IN THE FLESH most certainly does, and HAS COME IN THE FLESH is the language found in Scripture, not ‘coming’ or ‘came.’ If you think this is a matter of semantics, you haven’t sufficiently pondered the words and their meanings. You carelessly substitute alternate words when you quote Scripture which means you have precious little respect for the ACTUAL words chosen by the Author of Scirpture.

      “…born from the sexual union of Joseph and Mary…”

      Only in your unsubstantiated imagination, Arthur.

      “It is “Very very” odd that in all of these 1,923 words in this essay, that there is not even “One” positive comment of agreement on anything I have said…”

      What color is the sky in your world, friend? You just wrote and posted an article (yet another) which nakedly and rebelliously contradicts the Word of God. And now you’re put off that it hasn’t been received with accolades? Good grief man, if only you would listen to yourself (and actually hear what you are saying).

      “…just others being judgmentalism (sic) and legalistic in there (sic) mindset.”

      If by ‘judgmentalism’ and legalistic you mean arguing in accord with the Word of God, then I guess we’re guilty as charged. Should we be impressed with the words of a man who comes here to share ideas that are wildly incommensurate with the Word, who demands that those ideas are of a higher authority than even the ideas of God Himself, and who then refuses to offer any explanation for why he believes the way he does? We’re not impressed. To date, all you have managed to do is make unsupported statements and then repeat them over and over.

      “TCB and others strain a gnat and swallow the camel, and become very faithful, dedicated Christian Pharisees…”

      And what are you? A man who invents ideas about the word and then accuses others of being Pharisees when they oppose both you and your non-scriptural ideas. And are we Pharisees because we don’t believe your word merely because you spoke it?

      “Keep being delusional in thinking the Pope and his scribe’s didn’t change the Bible message…”

      Why should anyone think so, Arthur? Because you say so. But your fantasies about Scripture won’t work without such unsubstantiated and unverifiable claims. WHERE IS THE VALUE IN YOUR MESSAGE? I ask in all sincerity. If your message is worth ANYTHING, then please demonstrate how it is you know the ‘popes’ changed the Scriptures to hide your gospel. WHY should anyone believe your words just because you say them? Are yours the words of an ultra-enlightened sage who knows what no one else knows? Or wouldn’t anyone be a fool for merely accepting your word sans ANY corroborating evidence or supporting documentation of any kind whatsoever. Just who do you think you are?

      “Everything that is said by Jesus is referring to God only and not the body of Jesus.”

      This is nonsense. Everything I say doesn’t refer to my body but my words have reference to their intended and proper subjects, given the context of my language at the time I spoke it. But what have I really just said? Nothing at all.

      “All the “I AM’s statements are referring to God ONLY, and Jesus is telling us about Him.”

      Wouldn’t it be easier to just let His words say what they so obviously mean? Why is it so important for you to make of Him less than He IS?

      “God became a son on earth to share with the human race about our Creator, and not himself.”

      Not even you can explain this statement. I know what you meant to write, but that’s not what you wrote. The truth is just itching to explode from your digital pen but you keep standing in its way.

      “I don’t have time for all this nonsense.”

      Then disable comments or stop posting. Don’t you dare come here and complain when you post articles with comment sections beneath them and then folks actually take the time to comment. You don’t have time because you have not the foggiest idea how to defend your vain assertions against counter arguments rendered by men who know the Scriptures. Make time or go do something else where you won’t harass Bible believers with your anti-scriptural hogwash.

      “…but I don’t have the time or desire to argue with others…”

      It is the ability you lack, Arthur. If you had the ability, you would certainly be inclined to take the time. It should disturb you greatly that you have no answers whatsoever for the simple objections raised against your claims. It should cause you to lose sleep and induce you to look for answers without ceasing until you find them.

      “L.O.L.”

      That about sums it up, doesn’t it.

    • TCB did so answer your one question. He said…

      “You are. You are one who denies that He has come in the flesh.”

      … what’s the matter, Arthur, (or is that Artful Dodger?) is truth not in you?

  • I wouldn’t be surprised if most or all of the individuals who reply to my essays are senior citizens (and it is always the same individuals). They are very opinionated in these twilight years. They seem to not have jobs, so they have all the time in the world to pretty much post “Only” negative comments (and never anything positive). They apparently have never written any essays for others to read, and they only have time to criticize others.

    Since God has never established a Christian denomination (Catholic, Baptist, Methodist, Mormon etc.) they still feel they need to verbally harass anyone who doesn’t agree with their Christian dogma.

    I am curious what are the names of their organized denominational churches that THEY say represents a righteous true church denomination?

    They can’t reveal what church’s they go to, because they want to promote their “Traditions of men” IN SECRET, and hide revealing the source of their beliefs. For all their judgmental behaviors or attitudes revealing their carnal mental departure from what a normal, loving, and caring human being would look like from God’s point of view.

    Sincerely,
    Arthur Trafford

Top Stories
Recent Stories

Register

Newsletter

Email this story
Email this story

If you really want to ban this commenter, please write down the reason:

If you really want to disable all recommended stories, click on OK button. After that, you will be redirect to your options page.